Contradictions of Muhammad Al-Albani in Grading Hadith

51 Responses to Contradictions of Muhammad Al-Albani in Grading Hadith

1. Abu-Usaama says:

   August 27, 2008 at 11:11 pm

   subhanAllah i love the hadeeth in ex. 9

   may Allah forgive al-albani and us all.
2. Harun says:

   August 27, 2008 at 11:56 pm

   Imam Al-Albani is not a scholar of hadith because he changed his views on a few hadith?! Such ignorance. According to the same logic Imam Shafi’i is not a scholar of fiqh, since, as is well known, he revised many of his views when the truth became apparent to him!

   Actually, it is the mark of a scholar that they admit their mistakes and revise their views as they learn and gain more. You don’t have to agree with Imam Al-Albani to respect him as a scholar. And one can respect him as a scholar and still point out that he did make many mistakes and adopt some strange views, may Allah forgive him.
3. Harun says:

   August 27, 2008 at 11:57 pm

   The Question:

   It is said that Al-Shaikh Nasir Al-Den Al-Bani, may Allah have mercy upon him, used to declare hadith weak that were in fact strong and vice versa? Is this truly the case or not?

   The Answer:

   Indeed, Sheikh Albani (ra) was from those who revived the art of examining and criticizing hadith during these times. Indeed, due to him, many people became interested in the study of the Sunna (way of the Prophet (sa) and the science of examining reports, investigating reporters of hadith and the extraction of sound narrations. In fact, we can safely say that he was the most famous person in this age regarding this important science and it is well known the he exercised a great amount of effort towards this field.

   However, like any other human being who exerts great effort, some of his conclusions were correct and others were not. Thus, some of the hadith, which he declared sound, others in his field failed to agree with. Thus, these errors were made manifest to him and he corrected them. In addition, some of the narrations which he declared as weak were not agreed upon by those in his field. Then, once he was shown his errors, he went back and corrected them. Thus, if you look at many of the books written by the Sheikh, may Allah have mercy on him, there reprints would indicate where the sheikh went back, upon the advice of the Ulema, and changed his opinions. This is one of the great qualities of the scholars: that, when shown their mistakes, they would try to correct them with great haste and concern out of the sincerity towards the faith and truthfulness toward it. For that reason Umar Al-Khatab (ra) wrote to Abu Musa Al-Ashari (ra), “Returning back to the truth is better than stubbornness on falsehood.” Therefore, the Sheikh, on a number of occasions, would return to his work and correct it accordingly.

   However, as with any person, there are sure to be mistakes after the demise of the Sheikh (ra) because there is none amongst us who are protected by Allah from making mistakes and having shortcomings (except the Prophets). Thus, it behooves us not to accept everything the Sheikh declared as sound without investigation. And at the same time, we should examine what he declared to by weak prior to accepting it as well.

   The reason for this is that the scholars differed on the ability, of those who would come in the latter years of the Muslim nation, to declare hadith sound or weak. Ibn Salah (ra) felt that it was impossible since the later scholar would not have met those who preceded him. Imam Nawawi (ra) differed and felt thus such an action was indeed possible.

   There is an important point that should be noted: namely, declaring something sound is much easier than declaring something weak. The reason being that in order to declare something sound, one only needs one sound narration, however, when declaring something weak, one could have amassed a large number of narrations, but still there could be one sound one that they failed to locate. Thus, they might declare something weak that, due to one other narration, would make it sound. Thus declaring something weak is much harder than the opposite.

   One of the areas that Sheikh Albani (ra) was mistaken in was that he relied, in some cases, on manuscripts that suffered from printing errors. Many times these manuscripts were not narrated to the Sheikh, or he did not read them to the people of knowledge. Thus, at times, because of the printing errors, he fell into error; sometime declaring a hadith weak due to the printing error in the book. An example of this is the hadith found in the collection of Al-Bayhaqi which, in a misprinted copy states, from ‘Ubaydullah the son of Abdullah bin Abbas (ra). Sheikh Albani (ra) declared this hadith to be weak saying: “‘Ubaydullah bin Abdullah bin Abbas is an unknown person.”However, the correct print of Al-Bayhaqi’s texts states: “From ‘Ubadullah from Abdullah bin Abbas (ra). This ‘Ubaydullah is actually ‘Ubaydullah the son of Abdullah the son of ‘Utbah the son of the son of Mas’od one of the great seven jurists of Medina. He is considered the most trust worthy narrator when it comes to Ibn Abbas (ra) as agreed upon by the scholars.

   This error was due to a printing error and a cause for the Sheikh to declare the narration weak. However, this type of mistake was not due to the Sheikh himself, but was due to the print or a mistake of a scribe. It is important to note that such an error takes nothing away from the Sheikh nor his efforts, sincerity, knowledge or stature. For, indeed, it was a mistake, and none of us are free from error.

   And Allah knows best

   Sh. Muhammad Hassan Walid Didou Al-Shinqiti

   Translated by Suhaib D. Webb
4. Abul Layth says:

   August 28, 2008 at 1:19 am

   Harun, did I say that this is THE REASON why he is not a scholar in hadith?

   I actually said,

   lending to the Sunni claim that he is not a scholar of hadith and is in fact not authorized, or even qualified, to grade chains.

   He retracted his verdicts on over 210 narrations (and more – or simply did not retract and contradicted himself). Can you give us an example of a solidified scholar of hadith that retracted his gradings on over 210 ahadith from our salaf?

   Your comparison of Al Albaani to Shafi’i only shows how truly ignorant you are. Al Albani does not even have fiqh credentials, nor credentials in hadith to even matter, may Allah have mercy upon him.

   Al Albani is not a Mujtahid, whereas Ash-Shafi’i is. If he were a full-fledged Mujtahid your argument may have held weight.
5. Abul Layth says:

   August 28, 2008 at 1:22 am

   Many times these manuscripts were not narrated to the Sheikh, or he did not read them to the people of knowledge.

   Another reason for his blunders. He did not follow the Sunnic method of receiving hadith, and instead followed the “do it yourself Islam”.
6. Harun says:

   August 28, 2008 at 12:55 pm

   An aalim changing his verdict does not mean he is not an aalim. It doesn’t matter whether you listed it as ‘a’ reason or ‘the’ reason, the fact of the matter is that the statement that it lends to the Sufi claim that he is not a scholar of hadith is entirely baseless and ludicrous because it lends nothing to that claim.

   And you need to read properly. I mentioned Ash-Shafi’i to expose the fallacy in your reasoning, not to make a comparison with Al-Albani. I wouldn’t dream of comparing ANY modern day ‘aalim to the likes of ash-Shafi’i JUST LIKE you wouldn’t compare any of your “traditionalist” shaykhs to ash-Shafi’i. So asking for an example from the salaf is wrong to begin with. I don’t have to make someone at the level of the salaf to respect them as an ‘aalim. I have no problem acknowledging that he had flaws in his acquisition of knowledge, in his fiqh, etc. but doesn’t mean I disrespect him or say he’s not a scholar.

   My argument would have held weight if he was a mujtahid?! Look at the fallacy in that – its only acceptable if he is at the GREATEST level of scholarship, otherwise he’s not a scholar at all!

   And I will give you a refutation from classical scholars. Adh-Dhahabi mentions in his Tarikh that approximately one quarter of Al-Haakim’s Mustadrak is rejected and spurious narrations that are unauthentic. That would be 2261 Ahaadeeth that Al-Haakim was mistaken about.

   So compare Al-Haakim’s mistake in 2261 ahaadeeth, and yet he is still a great muhaddith, to Al-Albani’s mistake in 210 ahaadeeth. then you see the absurdity of yoru reasoning.

   anyway, this will be my last comment here.

   wasalaam
7. Abul Layth says:

   August 28, 2008 at 1:00 pm

   Actually it is you who claims that he is an ‘alim, not us. So the premise of your argument is itself a fallacy. For what proof do you have that he is an ‘Alim according to Sunni standards?
8. tru_Qur'an says:

   August 28, 2008 at 8:38 pm

   Assalaamu ‘Alaykum

   Abul Layth said,

   He retracted his verdicts on over 210 narrations (and more – or simply did not retract and contradicted himself). Can you give us an example of a solidified scholar of hadith that retracted his gradings on over 210 ahadith from our salaf?

   Harun said,

   So compare Al-Haakim’s mistake in 2261 ahaadeeth, and yet he is still a great muhaddith, to Al-Albani’s mistake in 210 ahaadeeth. then you see the absurdity of yoru reasoning.

   Abul Layth…does this suffice as an answer to your original question?
9. Usooli says:

   August 28, 2008 at 9:18 pm

   al-Albani is one person my heart never felt at peace with him even during my hard salafi days.

   I remember 10 years ago when I first started to practice the deen back in Arabia, whenever I found something beautiful of the deen with regards to virtues of good deeds, bounties of paradise, different forms of dhikr, wonderful instances of the Prophet’s(saws) seerah, his miracles and actions of the sahabah, I found the followers of Albani attacking those narrations classifying them week and baseless based on the faulty conclusions of their al-Albani, and making one fall down in Eman, and have the connection of this deen’s spirit and beauty, be cut off.
   Then I had some of their people requiring the masses’ women not to wear gold because their muhadith declared so, requiring/limiting only one form of prayer, and many other matters that contradicted the established opinions of the 4 schools, out of lack of usool and bigotry.
   Latter on I found out how this individual was erroneous in his gradings, how horrible he was in fiqh, and how much he was injustice, and furthermore how horrid his doctrine was in terms of Allah ’s qualities and attributes.
   Since the beginning, deep inside myself i developed rancour towards this person, without expressing my thoughts due to the dominant wahhabi community pressure, and the day this individual died, in all truth I felt a sense of relief, and looked at it as if it was a blessing from Allah that this liar on the hadeeth of the Prophet[saws], and this enemy of islam’s spirit was finally gone.

   The Wahhabiyya are an evil cult, they are mujassims/anthromorphs in their doctrines/beliefs, chaotic in fiqh, and lack/reject the knowledge of Ihsan/tasawuff, they are destroying Islam under the name of Islam, and are khawarij in approach with their ill judgement of other muslims, their improper understanding of uboodiyyah to Allah , their faulty takfeer, and useage of Ayahs related to the kafirun upon the muslims. The origin of their evil comes from the accursed land of Najd from which Satan’s horns rise, and the founder of their sect Muhammad Ibn Abdel Wahhab, was a thief and murderer, who massacred and destroyed the lives of many innocent muslims that became victims of his faulty takfeer, and this is according to their own sources like Ibn Ghannam’s Tarikh an Najd, where Ibn Ghannam being a close associate and companion of the khariji ibn abdelwahab.

   Anywhere these people went they brought in with themselves destruction/affliction of that muslim community, and have driven many people out of Islam because of their extermism, hooliganism and lack of spirituality, and have made the affairs of the enemies of Islam easier in their dominance of muslims and their lands.
10. Abul Layth says:

    August 28, 2008 at 10:09 pm

    Assalaamu ‘Alaykum

    Abul Layth said,

    He retracted his verdicts on over 210 narrations (and more – or simply did not retract and contradicted himself). Can you give us an example of a solidified scholar of hadith that retracted his gradings on over 210 ahadith from our salaf?

    Harun said,

    So compare Al-Haakim’s mistake in 2261 ahaadeeth, and yet he is still a great muhaddith, to Al-Albani’s mistake in 210 ahaadeeth. then you see the absurdity of yoru reasoning.

    Abul Layth…does this suffice as an answer to your original question?

    Wa’alaykum Salam Tru…

    I originally had written a response to this statement but I thought Harun’s claims were so obsurd that I just left it as it was.

    Since you have pressed me, as Tru always seems to do, I will abridge my first response:

    1) Al-Hakim studied and mastered Ulum al-Hadith tranditionally. He heard hadith through the proper channels, and had masters grant him the proper certifications/permissions to teach the science. Ex: Ad-Daraqutni

    Whereas Al Albani did not hear the works of hadith via the proper channels, made ridiculous blunders, thought his judgement superior than those superior to him, overstepped his limits – considering he was not established in the sciences of hadith traditionally.

    2) This claim against Al-Hakim needs commenting upon. Anyone who knows anything about the Mustadarak knows very good and well that this work was written near the death of Al-Hakim. It was his intent to revise the Mustadarak and he began doing so only completing the first volume. This was mentioned by Shaykh Mamduh in his Rafa’ Manara and he also added, “outside of the Mustadarak, his positions are as strict as those of any of the meticulous Imâms of hadîth.”

    When one reviews the first volume of the Mustadarak one finds few errors if any – even as can be seen by the notes of Adh-Dhahabi in his Talkhis who even professed that it had not been written by Al-Hakim.

    In other words, what we have of the Mustadarak is not the finished product as mentioned by Sakhawi in his Fathul Mughith. So the claim that these were “mistakes” are only true if they be applied to the first volume. The other volumes, in reality, were not reviewed as Al-Hakim had wanted to do and thus one can not hold him accountable for what he was unable to finish.

    3) Again, the comparison between Al-Hakim and Al Albaani is like comparing Gold to rock. Al Albani is not a scholar of hadith as can be seen by his atrocious claims – like his weakening many ahadith in Sahih Muslim – or his lack of education in the field.

    There is one good thing to Al Albani’s credit, though such does not make him a scholar of Hadith, and that is through his mistakes and blunders many begun researching and this helped to revive the sciences of hadith in the 20th century – even though such revivalism is not only due to him but due also to the Shakirs, Arna’uts, Ghumaris etc and many of the subcontinental A’immah who dedicated their lives to this science who always seem to go unmentioned by the pseudo-salafis.

    Lastly, I recently stumbled upon another book that was scanned by Sidi Abul Hasan writted by Shaykh Mamduh:

    “Tanbih al-Muslim Ila Ta`addi al-Albani `ala Sahih Muslim: Warning to the Muslim Concerning al-Albani’s Attack on Sahih Muslim”.

    Shaykh Mamduh exposes the ridiculous claims of Al Albani regarding Sahih Muslim and how he weakened numerous hadith therein, departing from the majority of the Ummah’s agreement upon its authenticity. It is a good read for those interested.
11. IbnTaymiya says:

    August 28, 2008 at 10:10 pm

    To Usooli:
    Unfortunately, many of the accusations you hurled at the “wahhabis” in you last post could be applied to what you would probably call today’s “traditional” muslims.
    And I would advise you not to call the peole of knowlegde liars,etc. This WILL have negative repercussions on your deen. Al-albani may Allah have mercy on him could (in all reality) be a Wali of Allah (and no he doesn’t have to go around calling himself one like some of the heads of tariqahs in this day and age, nor does he have to orchestrad weekly dances in the name of remembering Allah ). So respect the scholars, buddy.
    I know the feelings you picked up being around some salafis because I went thru the same thing, but all this doesn’t warrant an open-season approach towards scholars who are not perfect.
    Salaam
12. Abul Layth says:

    August 28, 2008 at 10:17 pm

    When did Al Albani become a scholar or in your words “a person of knowledge”? Where do you people get these claims from?

    As for everything he said about the wahhabis, it is true. Why don’t you tell of the massacre of At-Ta’if “ibn taymiyyah” or the massacre at karbala’ where women and children were massacred at the hands of the wahhabis? It is proudly attested to by the wahhabi historians!
13. Abul Layth says:

    August 28, 2008 at 10:22 pm

    Imam Ibn ‘Abidin writes:

    “His words and who consider the Companions of our Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) to be disbelievers are not a condition for someone to be a kharijite, but rather are a mere clarification of what those who revolted against ‘Ali (Allah Most High be well pleased with him) in fact did. Otherwise, it is enough to be convinced of the unbelief of those they fight against, as happened in our own times with the followers of [Muhammad ibn] ‘Abd al-Wahhab, who came out of the Najd in revolt, and took over the sanctuaries of Mecca and Medina. They followed the Hanbali madhhab, but believed that they were the Muslims, and that those who believed differently than they did were polytheists (mushrikin). On this basis, they held it lawful to kill Sunni Muslims (Ahl al-Sunna) and their religious scholars, until Allah Most High dispelled their forces, and the armies of the Muslims attacked their strongholds and subdued them in 1233 A.H. [1818] (Hashiya radd al-muhtar, 4.262).

    http://www.masud.co.uk/ISLAM/nuh/masudq6.htm
14. IbnTaymiya says:

    August 29, 2008 at 1:46 am

    As for the ‘wahhabi massacres’ they have been dealt with numerous times elsewhere. And please save us the references to the biased masud site.
    As for Al-Sheikh Al-Muhaddith Al-albani’s having “changed his mind” about 200 hadiths, if I showed you what the scholars of hadith in the past (the calibre of Ibn Hajar, Suyuti, etc..) said regarding hadiths you would know that recanting from grading a hadith authentic or weak was not unusual. Also there was a lot of opposing opinions regarding the grading of hadiths between different hadith imams.
    As for Sheikh Al-Albani’s few “unusual” fatwas, I say again, NO Scholar is free from error. For example, Ibn Hazm said it was OK to listen to music. He also said it was Ok to jack off. I believe Imam Shawkani did too but dont quote me on that.
    So point being, it isn’t right to take a few odd fatwas and use that to condemn a scholar. I bet all you know about the shaykh is what you’ve heard from haters.
    Be balanced, homeboy.
    Salam
15. Ibn Ahmad says:

    August 29, 2008 at 1:49 am

    Salaams Everyone,

    I’m with you Sidi Usooli & Sidi Abul Layth. One interaction with a Salafi will leave a really bitter taste in your mouth.

    I was at the masjid today and praying my asr. I noticed there was someone who was ever-watchful of me and pacing back and forth as if waiting for me to finish my salah.

    Immediately when I finished, he came up to me and told me that my sujood was ALL WRONG and that I need to keep my knees straight. I smiled and thanked him for the naseeha.

    However, according to The Guiding Helper that form of sujood is only mandub and its absence hardly qualifies one to render a sujood ALL WRONG. Furthermore, I have extremely tight hamstring muscles, so much so that I often suffer sciatic nerve pain. So as much as I would like to keep my knees straight, if I did so, I would not be able to keep my back straight. It’s an issue of biomechanics and anatomy. Nothing I would expect an extremist to understand. So I just said thank you.

    But I thougth to myself, what gives this guy the right to bombard another human being after his prayer and chastize him so? The salah is something between the ‘abd and the Lord and if there are no gross defects therein, no one should lambast another on account thereof.

    Sorry for ranting and raving, but this is one of the many examples to which Usooli alluded.

    Am I wrong to have felt this way? Should I give this individual the benefit of the doubt?

    Anyway, I’ll start a stretch regimine Insha’Allah .
16. Ebrahim says:

    August 29, 2008 at 5:17 am

    I agree with brother Usooli and and ibn Ahmad. I have met many wahabis in my life and they to me are among the worst creatures on earth. I have been abused, called a kafir, mushrik etc by them for supporting tasawwuf.But I consider that as normal, because deviants are incapable of good akhlaaq and adab, and alhamdulillah many people are leaving their deviant manhaj after seeing their behaviour.
17. IbnTaymiya says:

    August 29, 2008 at 6:05 am

    SalamAlaicom,
    There are a lot of ignorant, non-akhlaq acting salafis in the west. I’ve experienced some of what you guys are saying. But I’ve been here in the U.S. and I’ve been around the MiddleEast (a few countries). Some conclusions I’ve been coming to:
    1- Sheikh Nuh said that in America, Wahhabism is the “default” Islam. I say: it’s become or becoming the default Islam in Jordan, Palestine and Yemen(from what I’ve seen), not to mention Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states.

    2-Sad to say, there has been some Shi’ite-ization going on in previously Sunni-only areas due to first of all, alot of ignorance of the deen amongst many sunni muslims, and also due to the Iranian Shiite power. If you study the nature of this you will find that the seeds of this are finding fertile ground in very-Sufi oriented environments. And I swear by Allah , I am not intentionally trying to be biased here. Do your research on how Shiism has gained a foothold in Egypt, Sudan, Syria. Oh yeah, you know about that hardcore shiite majority in Southern Iraq, surprisingly it wasn’t like that JUST 50 years ago. My point :
    It seems to be that the good ol’ Salafites are the ones putting up the fight. THEY seem to be the ones defending Sunni Islam.
    3- There are a bunch of Salafi-oriented Satellite Channels that have been going up in recent years Egyptian ones and gulf-state ones. More and more, the Islam that people hear…the default Islam is Salafi-oriented Islam.

    Wallahi I love the Imams who died on the Salafi way and what they have left us, and Wallahi I love the Imams who died on the Ash’ari/Maturidi way and what they have left for us.
    Sunni Islamic history obviously demonstrates to us that things were never black and white. Imam Saffarini al-Hanbali says in his Aqeeda book Lawami’ al-Anwaar that the term Ahlu-Sunnah wal-Jama’ah has been used to mean:
    The Aqeedah of the Ash’ariyyah
    The Aqeedah of the Maturidiyyah
    The Aqeedah of the Athariyyah/Hanabila.
    Now this last category is the “predecessor’ of the aqida of today’s salafis. Maybe in our times some of the formerly less-popular views in the Athari aqeeda have gained more popularity among the atharis/Hanbalis/ Salafis, but the point is..they have a source. Let’s all just respect each other.
    I’d like to hear your thoughts on these points Ive stated. Now, again, I accept both sides and wish that everyone got along.
    P.s. If I get an attacking, bigoted response, I’ll have no choice but to unleash the article on how Ash’arism wasn’t always the “default” sunni aqida and how they hijacked the Shafi’i mathhab and when supported by the rulers, they suppressed Hanbali aqida!
    I love you guys,
    Salam
18. Ibn Ahmad says:

    August 29, 2008 at 10:46 am

    The following is an excerpt from:

    Al-Misri, Ahmad ibn Naqib, Reliance of the Traveler (T. Nuh Ha Mim Keller)(1994). Amana Publications: Beltsville, Maryland, USA. p. 782.

    _________________________

    “…Among them are those who busy themselves with theological polemics against heretical beliefs, and refuting the unorthodox. Scholars engaged in this are of two types, those in the wrong and those in the right, the former advocating something other than the sunna, the latter advocating the sunna. BOTH are DELUDED. The misguidedness of those those in the wrong is obvious (A:since they have left the Koran and sunna which are divinely protected). As for those in the right, their delusion is believing that arguing is the most important activity and greatest spiritual work in the religion of Allah Most High. They maintain that one’s religion is not complete until one has made lengthy investigations into one’s beliefs, and that someone who simply believes in Allah and His Messenger (صلى الله عليه وسلم) without preparing a case for it is deficient in faith. Because of this mistaken presumption, they spend their lives learning how to dispute, conducting in-depth studies of statements of theological controversies until their spiritual insight eventually goes blind. They do not pause to consider that the early Muslims, whom the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) testified where the very best of mankind, and who lived to see many a reprehensible innovation (bid’a) and deviant belief, did not expose themselves and their religion to quarrels and disputation, or busy themselves therein at the expense of their hearts and works. They did not talk about it at all, except under necessity to refute misguidance. And if they saw someone persisting in blameworty innovation, they had nothing more to do with him, without further debate or argument. The hadith has reached us: ‘No people went astray after having been guided save that they were afflicted with arguing.’”

    ____________

    In the words of Sheikh Faraz Rabbani, the Sunni-Shi’i divide is over 1400 years old. No one in our lifetime will resolve it or come up with that magic argument that will turn the hearts of the Shi’a.
19. IbnTaymiyya says:

    August 29, 2008 at 4:54 pm

    Maybe no one in our lifetime will come up with that magic argument to cure the sick hearts of the shi’a, but the least that can be done (aside from continuously putting the truth regarding these matters out there for those who seek it) is to keep our sunni bretheren well informed about the Sunni stance on these issues with daleel.
    Otherwise it seems that the logic/thinking of some not-so-informed Sunni (sufi) muslims leads them to think like this:
    Tawassul/Ziyara/Etc. @ Sheikh Rifai grave
    V S .
    Tawassul/Ziyara/Etc @ Hussain in Karbala

    and so on…there are similarities in the practices/types of bleiefs of some sufis and shiites that the transition often only requires
    1. Shaking the foundations of the Sunni belief that ALL the Sahaba were upright & trustworthy.
    2. Convincing them that they have the knowledge of Ahlul bayt.
    3. Taking advantage of the sufi view of their sheikhs (like the naqshbandis believe about Sh. Nazim) that once they become his murids all of their affairs are in his hands i.e. he’ll be their at their death, their resurrection, to answer on their behalf, and take them to jannah (astaghfirullah). Shiites convince them that Imam Ali is more worthy of being held in this position.

    When Sh. Yusuf Rifa’i, head of the Rifa’i tariqa in Kuwait was asked by a Shiite on TV during a conversation: When will you become a Shiite? He says: when the mahdi comes out. (!?) And then he gets annihilated on TV during a debate with one of Kuwaits Salafi Sheikhs Abdur-rahman Abdul-khaliq, I’ll find the debate video and post it.
20. anon says:

    August 29, 2008 at 9:19 pm

    Thanks bro. Ibn Taymiyyah for mentioning this very important point of these Sufis gravitating to the Baatini religion of the Raafidah. It reminds of an Arabic saying: “at-tuyoor ‘ala shaakilatiha taka’ “. And truly we are seeing this in the Arab world. It’s not just that Sufi clown, Yusuf ar-Rifa’i, but others like Hasan as-Saqqaf, Ali al-Jifri, Sa’id Mamduh (cited by Abu Layth for his criticisms of Albani) who attacked Umar ibn al-Khattab(RA) as mentioned in Ahl al Hadeeth forum, Ahmad Hassoon; the baatini “Mufti” of Syria who says secularism is from Islaam!, that you can’t make takfeer of the Jews and Christians and especially his masters, the Nusayri tawagheet, and yet we see this charlatan has the gall to impugn the Sahaabah(RA). There are others like the aforementioned Sufis. This is not to say that there aren’t Sufis who are opposed to the Raafidah and the spreading of their beliefs. For example, 2 of the biggest Sufi tariqahs in Sudan joined with the Ansar as-Sunnah al-Muhammadiyyah(the Wahabis!), the Ikhwan al-Muslimoon and other Sunni groups in warning the Sudanese government about Raafidhi missionary activity in Sudan. Yet we see other Sufi and Ash’ari groups who are obsessed with Wahabi this and Wahabi that are silent on this matter like Ali al-Jafri one of the signatories to the pathetic fatwa,” A Common Word” addressed to that mini-Dajjaal, the pope, and other Christian leaders. Instead of calling them to Tawheed and repudiating their baatil aqeedah, they call them to empty words like “love of God”. This “Common Word” fatwa was signed by many Sufis, Ash’aris, modernists, etc. What is interesting about this “fatwa” is that Christian leaders are addressed as your “Holiness” and other honorific terms. One of the signatories was Hasan as-Saqqaf, who is known for being anti-Salafi who uses terms such as “Mutamaslifah” to address the Salafis and yet we see him signing a document referring to the Pope as “samahat al Baba”!.
21. Abul Layth says:

    August 30, 2008 at 4:44 am

    Anon: No one is fooled by your stupid name calling. No substance and nothing worth responding to. Its funny you mention the Batinite movement, considering is was the Asha’ri shafi’i Al-Ghazzali that destroyed their da’wah through refutations and prolific dialogue.

    Ibn Taymiyyah: My observations are definitely different than yours. What I see is a resurgence of traditionalism – the way of the Ottomans and the way of the Sunnis of old. Every time I go to a Suhbah I see hundreds of new converts to the Sunni manhaj the majority of them being ex-pseudo-salafis. Everytime I travel to masaajid – especially here in America – I always see youth and college students abandoning the wahhabified da’wa of non-sense and accepting the way of the Sunnic forefathers.

    The world is what you make it though. We choose to interpret the world as we choose to. It certainly is true that the wahhabis have been active in targeting the ignorant Muslims who hear “sunnah” and “salaf” and think such terms must mean that the people screaming them are on the truth. Forget not that the Mu’tazilah of old called themselves the flagbearers of the Sunnah – the analogy is no different in our times.

    I foresee that salafi burnout will continue and more will continue to pick up the works of G.F. Haddad and Abdullah Hamid Ali. There is a resurgence of Sunni print via Turath, White thread, and others. The Sunni movement has revived itself and it is seen through the influx of refutations against Al Albani, the Najdi scholars, and those in alliance with their da’wah of tajsim and takfir.

    What I have noticed is that the Sunnis are not nearly as loud as the yelling, violent, fear mongering pseudo-salafis. It is for this reason that they seem larger than what they really are. They must scream because they are the minority. They must utilize violence and tactics of intimidation or else they will be ignored.

    The bottom line is the Sunnis are beginning to realize that Sunnic propoganda must begin in order to save the souls of the masses from the fitnah- touch of the wahhabis. Everything they touch turns to poison. How many Muslims have I seen apostate because of their stupidity and draconian principles. It is time to bathe their batil da’wah with the pure water of tasawwuf and revive the way of the Salaf-us-Salih!

    was-salam

    Reminder: Stay on Topic from here on out – that is Al-Albani and his contradictions.
22. Ibn Ahmad says:

    August 30, 2008 at 5:35 am

    It’s not so much the fact that Al Albani made mistakes in hadith grading, as it is the outcome of those gradings and the severe calamities that arose therefrom.

    These mistakes have turned friend into foe, resulted in many individuals cutting ties of the womb, voices being raised in the mosques, and worse yet, unjustifiable murder in addition to a plethora of other unspeakable nightmares.

    I believe this to be the major reason why the scholars have responded to him so. It’s not personal!

    I’m sure Albani the man was a pretty cool guy. He had a handsome, welcomming countenance about him. However, Albani the scholar, May Allah Bless Him…well…we know the rest of the story!
23. Irfan says:

    August 30, 2008 at 7:18 am

    same in my place too.
    there are many people who say both wahabiyya and ahlus sunnah -all are ok . take good from both etc.
    the only thing needed to make them a pure sunni is to make a wahabi open his mouth. after hearing all the distortions, shirk,kafir, etc the others who havent made up their mind soon become strong sunni’s.
    i even have a friend who became a sunni for the sole reason that a wahabi had called the parents of Prophet SAW unbelievers.
24. Usooli says:

    August 30, 2008 at 3:01 pm

    just remember Albani was very disrespectful when it came to the status of the Prophet(saws). He has one disturbing claim that there is no proof of the Prophet(saws) being the best of creation, ignoring the massive references that establish otherwise, saying that it is possible for the ummahatel momineen to fall into major shocking vice, making belittlement joking and laughing at the companions, and holding to be bid’a the sending of salawaat on the Prophet(saws) after adhaan, whereas it has been established authentically from the Prophet(saws) that whoever hears the mudhain(caller of adhan) and says like what he says then says the salawat on him and asks from Allah waseelah for him, then his shafaah/intercession becomes mandatory for him on the day of judgement.

    This was a person who was vulgar,shameless and obsence in speech. Here is a video of Albani where you can see his manners for yourself:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klTvgPZZHbA

    Morever this individual had horrible manners with those around him or those who disagreed with his nonesense, whereas he used to jump often in boycotting those who disagreed with him on minor matters, and this has been attested by many. An understanding of how his character might have been , is the common bad traits of rudeness, arrogance, stubborness, bigotry that is seen amongst his direct students like ali al halabi of jordan , and this shared commanlity amongst these students, points to the formation of these depeleted traits as a result of their teacher’s influence, as someone who sits by a blacksmith has some of the smoke fall on him.

    These are the kinds of people one should truely avoid, for they are not certified people to be scholars, who speak from ignorance, and who are devoid of the manners and characteristics of the Prophet(saws), and the wahhabis in general are a kind of people who are very irresponsible, they are the callers to the gates of hell.
25. Ebrahim says:

    August 30, 2008 at 4:55 pm

    Also,I heard that Albani gave a fatwa that the tomb of the prophet( peace unto him) should be demolished, astaghfirullah, what a great deviant! I truly agree with Usooli, this man albani was no good, and all his lovers are filthy mouthed who are always cursing others.
26. Ibn Ahmad says:

    August 30, 2008 at 5:15 pm

    SubhanAllah,

    I never knew, waLlahi. I would have never guessed in a million years that any Muslim period would ever utter such things.

    If all these things are ture ya Sidi Usooli and Sidi Ebrahim, then I take back every good thing I said about the man.

    That’s just frightening.
27. abdullah_85 says:

    August 30, 2008 at 7:16 pm

    salam,

    could someone translate that youtube video? I cannot understand arabic :(
28. Abu Zayd says:

    August 30, 2008 at 9:56 pm

    Abu Layth, how much sins do you have to bear in yumal qiyamah? Subhanallah, you are serious wasting your time attacking people who you have the least information. This so called sufi “shayks” are like children to Al-Albaani when it comes to the science of hadith…and everybody who is acquainted with his work can attest to this.

    Now, there were greater scholars of hadith which committed more mistakes than Shayk Al-Albaani but that did not lower their status…..I mean why can you credit the Shayk because of the fact that he re-adjusted his gradings on some narrations? To me, it is a proof that Shayk Al-Albaani was all about the haq and that he was not stubborn….he took nasiha from whoever was sincere and Allhumdullahi, he remains as one of the greatest scholars of ahlilhadith in our time, and he is like a mountain of knowledge.

    As for you, Abu Layth, then you are throwing small pebbles at this great mountain….and I all I can tell you is that you are wasting your time man. Shayk Al-Albaani has passed away and he has benefited many Muslims with regards to their religion…so, what have you and your sufi Shayks done for the ummah except inviting people to the doors of hell?

    Imaam Shafi’i once said,

    “Ignore the ignorant one, for indeed, everything he says is in reality in him. For indeed, the Euphrates river will not become impure just because few dogs swam in it”
29. Abul Layth says:

    August 31, 2008 at 4:27 am

    Abu Layth, how much sins do you have to bear in yumal qiyamah? Subhanallah, you are serious wasting your time attacking people who you have the least information. This so called sufi “shayks” are like children to Al-Albaani when it comes to the science of hadith…and everybody who is acquainted with his work can attest to this.

    That is laughable. G.F. Haddad has more credentials in hadith than Al-Albani and he is still considered from the Shabab. The Ghumari brothers have more asanid to the Nabi than al albaani. Don’t waste our time with beefing up your master when there is not enough hormones in the world to make him worthy of the title Muhaddith!

    You can claim what you want, but the fact is he was no scholar, nor did he have the credentials to be labeled such. Self study is an insufficient way of becoming a Muhaddith!
30. tru_Qur'an says:

    August 31, 2008 at 7:31 am

    Assalaamu ‘alaykum,

    Abul Layth…nothing against you or the brother; I just like to see debates agreed on by points and not just continuous statements without conclusions to the original point; this adds to a more structured discussion and helps move on to the next point(s).

    As for my question, I should have rephrased it by asking akhi Harun..

    Yes, everyone has shortcomings, so the word ‘mistake’is very general and fits on every glove but lets specify what TYPE of mistake we are refering to; the mistake of ‘contradictions’(which akhi Abul Layth has been refering to). Which big time Muhaddith had so many contradictions in his takreej of ahadith in the past and not just a’mistake’ (i.e. quoting fabricated ahadith etc)?

    Wallahu ’3alim
31. Ebrahim says:

    August 31, 2008 at 12:58 pm

    It seems wahabis are really angry now judging by the post of Abu Zayd. It’s sad to see people coming in defense of a guy like albani, who had no respect for the prophet sallallaahu alayhi wasallam. InshaAllah more and more people will leave wahabism and soon their fitnah will be over, but i also know a hadith that says these deviants will be with dajjal, so i guess some of them will stay till the time of dajjal, but we should continue exposing the wahabis and help our brothers and sisters in Islam.

    By the way, Abu Zayd seems to hate sufis and at the same time quotes Imam Shafi, so let me quote Imam Shafi on what he said about sufis,

    Be both, a faqih and a sufi: do not be only one of them,
    Verily, by Allah ’s truth, I am advising you sincerely.( al-Shafi`i, Diwan).

    I am quite sure the hardcore wahabis wont start loving sufis after this statement from Imam Shafi but it only shows their nature of picking and choosing which happens to be the characteristic of every single deviant group on earth. May Allah guide them ameen.
32. Mustafa says:

    August 31, 2008 at 9:55 pm

    as salaamu alaykum,

    May Allaah have mercy upon shaykh nasrudeen al albaani and his family ameen

    May Allaah forgive us for our gheebah and our injustice that we inflict on ourselves and others Ya ghafooru raheem ameen

    Ramadan is dawning on is ikhwan please let us reflect and spend much of our times reciting the Quran, studying the adab of the Prophet salalahu alayhi wa salam, the sirah, make much adhkar, and sit in muraqabah a lot. May Allaah give us the tawfeeq to worship him as the saliheen do ameen

    wasalaam
33. anon says:

    September 1, 2008 at 12:01 am

    It takes one to know one Abul Layth. It’s alright for you to ridicule and mock but when I respond, I’m “namecalling”. I will respond to your point about Shaykh al-Albani. I think many Sufis and Ash’aris think by refuting al-Albani that they are refuting the whole Salafi da’wah. It is true that Albani has weak ijazahs compared to other contemporary muhadditheen, but he is not wholly self-taught as you mentioned. Read his biographies and you will see this. And there are many Salafi muhadditheen who have strong ijazahs and are just as or even more knowledgebale in the sciences of hadeeth than Albani such as Ahmad Shakir, Badi’ ad-Deen ar-Raashidi, Hammaad al-Ansari, Muhammad as-Sumali, Abdul Qaadir al-Arna’ut and many more, especially in the Indian subcontinent.
    As to what you have termed “no substance and nothing worth responding to”, then what is your opinion of Shi’ite missionary activities in Sunni countries often with the colloboration of certain Sufis figures?
34. Abu Zayd says:

    September 1, 2008 at 2:49 am

    Ebrahim said,

    “By the way, Abu Zayd seems to hate sufis and at the same time quotes Imam Shafi…”

    Imam Shafi’ was not a sufi for your information. He actually refuted those people who were upon sufism. It was reported from him that he said,

    “if someone leaves their home in the morning practicing tasawuf, they would not return in noon except as an idiot.”

    So, how is that you attribute tasawuf to Imam Shafi’ (rahimullahi)? You need to go beyond the translations of your sufi Shayk and look into the actual words of Imam Shafi’, and then can you make profound statement about Imam Shafi’ and his views.

    Abu Layth, we are on this forum, you are staunchly defending people whom you have no idea who they are; while, I am defending someone whom a good portion of the Ummah has attested to their knowledge and truthfulness. So the question is, are you able to defend these misguided sufis before Allah in Judgement day?

    It is very strange that you are comparing G.F. Hadad to Al-Albani, that is funny man. Is that all you can come up with? Many of the Shuyook of Ahlil Sunnah, some who were scholars of hadith, like Ibn Baz, Hamaad Al-Ansari, Muqbil Al-waadi’, Adam Al-Ethiopi, Muhammad Abdullah as-Sumali, all of these scholars praised Sh. Al-Albani and said that his knowledge of hadith was immense.

    So how is wasting time?
35. Abul Layth says:

    September 1, 2008 at 6:48 am

    As to what you have termed “no substance and nothing worth responding to”, then what is your opinion of Shi’ite missionary activities in Sunni countries often with the colloboration of certain Sufis figures?

    The rest of your post has no substance just as your previous one lacked thereof, and is thus really not worth responding to. The stance of Ahlus Sunnah is that the Shi’ah are principally Muslims, just as the wahhabis are. However, they deem both groups deviant. It is interesting to note that the Ottomans did not massacre the shi’a that were in their territories unless they revolted, whereas the Wahhabis massacred many shi’a at karbalaa as reported by the wahhabi historian Uthman ibn Bashir.

    Whatever the case you are changing the topic and one of the rules of this site is that you stay on topic. Read: http://seekingilm.com/rules. Thank you.

    Imam Shafi’ was not a sufi for your information. He actually refuted those people who were upon sufism. It was reported from him that he said,

    It does not surprise me that you would use a weaker narration over that which is stronger!

    The correct wording is:

    “If a rational man does not become a S.ûfî he does not reach noon except he is a dolt!”

    Abû Nu`aym narrates this from Muh.ammad ibn `Abd al-Rah.mân ibn al-Fad.l, from Abû al-H.asan [Ah.mad ibn Muh.ammad ibn al-H.ârith] ibn al-Qattât [al-Mis.rî], from the thiqa Muh.ammad ibn Abî Yah.yâ, from the thiqa Imâm Yûnus ibn `Abdal-A`lâ, from the Imâm.

    The weaker version you have quoted:

    “A rational man does not become a S.ûfî except he reaches noon a dolt!”

    Al-Bayhaqî narrates this from al-H.âkim, from Abû Muh.ammad Ja`far ibn Muh.ammad ibn al-H.ârith,from al-H.asan ibn Muh.ammad ibn al-D.ah.h.âk (IbnBah.r), both of unknown reliability.

    And as Shaykh G.F. Haddad comments:

    “For obvious reasons, this is the preferred version of the detractors of Sufis.” See: http://www.livingislam.org/n/shs_e.html

    Furthermore, it is recorded that Imam Ash-Shafi’i stated:

    صحبت الصوفية فلم استفد منهم سوى حرفين، وفي رواية سوى ثلاث كلمات: قولهم: الوقت سيف إن لم تقطعه قطعك. وقولهم: نفسك إن لم تشغلها بالحق شغلتك بالباطل. وقولهم: العدم عصمة

    “I accompanied the Sufis for ten years and benefited from them but from two words: their statement that
    time is as a sword: if you do not cut it, it cuts you, and their statement that
    deprivation is immunity.”

    [The reported third states:

    “their statement: if your soul does not keep busy with truth it will keep you busy with batil.”

    Shaykh Gibril notes:

    Narrated from Muh.ammad ibn Muh.ammad ibn Idrîs al-Shâfi`î by al-Bayhaqî in Manâqib al-Shâfi`î (2:208) cf. Ibn al-Qayyim in Madârij al-Sâlikîn (3:128) and al-Jawâb al-Kâfî (p. 208-209) and al-Suyût.î in تأييد الحقيقة العلية Ta'yîd al-H.aqîqat al-`Aliyya (p. 15)

    Note that I have added the arabic to assist those interested.

    Also Imam al-'Ajluni reports:

    حبب إلي من دنياكم ثلاث: ترك التكلف، وعشرة الخلق بالتلطف، والاقتداء بطريق أهل التصوف

    [source: كشف الخفاء ومزيل الالباس عما اشتهر من الأحاديث عل ألسنة الناس]

    I suppose you also disagree with your Imam Ibn Taymiyyah who stated – declaring Ijmaa’ :

    فأما المستقيمون من السالكين كجمهور مشايخ السلف مثل الفضيل بن عياض، وإبراهيم بن أدهم، وأبي سليمان الداراني، ومعروف الكرخي، والسري السقطي، والجنيد بن محمد، وغيرهم من المتقدمين، ومثل الشيخ عبد القادرالجيلاني والشيخ حماد والشيخ أبي البيان، وغيرهم من المتأخرين، فهم لا يسوغون للسالك ولو طار في الهواء أو مشى على الماء أن يخرج عن الأمر والنهي الشرعيين، بل عليه أن يعمل المأمور ويدع المحظور إلى أن يموت. وهذا هوالحق الذي دل عليه الكتاب والسنة وإجماع السلف، وهذا كثير في كلامهم

    [Majmu' Fatawaa]

    And of course I expect the response to be, as always, “Those sufis were not like the sufis of our times!” – no proof and no knowledge of the methodology of tasawwuf. lol…The Sufis do not need my defense. They have the defense of Mujtahidin of this Ummah. Imam Al-Ghazzali stated:

    ولقد علمت يقينا أن الصوفية هم السالكون لطريق الله تعالى خاصة وأن سيرتهم أحسن السيرة وطريقتهم أصوب الطرق وأخلاقهم أزكى الأخلاق

    So what are your words in comparison to those mountains ? – as weak as a speck of dust in the wind.

    Stay on topic – last warning.

    Jazakum Allahu Khairan,
    Abul Layth
36. Ebrahim says:

    September 1, 2008 at 2:46 pm

    Thanks brother Abul Layth for telling the people about what Imam Shafi actually said about sufis. Yes, the wahabis will pick and choose as I said and thats the only way they can surivive. And only the ignorant people will ever accept their anti sufi stuff. Anyways, I wont talk about sufis here now since this is about exposing Albani. Ramadhan Kareem, Assalamu alaykum.
37. Ibn Ahmad says:

    September 1, 2008 at 7:18 pm

    فأما المستقيمون من السالكين كجمهور مشايخ السلف مثل الفضيل بن عياض، وإبراهيم بن أدهم، وأبي سليمان الداراني، ومعروف الكرخي، والسري السقطي، والجنيد بن محمد، وغيرهم من المتقدمين، ومثل الشيخ عبد القادرالجيلاني والشيخ حماد والشيخ أبي البيان، وغيرهم من المتأخرين، فهم لا يسوغون للسالك ولو طار في الهواء أو مشى على الماء أن يخرج عن الأمر والنهي الشرعيين، بل عليه أن يعمل المأمور ويدع المحظور إلى أن يموت. وهذا هوالحق الذي دل عليه الكتاب والسنة وإجماع السلف، وهذا كثير في كلامهم

    “As for those who walk the straight and narrow path of Islam amongst the travelers of tasawwuf (Salikin), then theirs is like the example of the vast majority of the leaders amongst our righteous predecessors, such as al-Fudayl bin ‘Iyad, Ibrahim bin Adham, Abi Sulayman al-Darani, Ma’rouf al-Karakhi, al-Sari al-Saqti, Junayd bin Muhammad, and others amongst our forefathers; and likewise the example of al-Sheikh ‘Abd al-Qadir al-Jilani, al-Sheikh Hammad, al-Sheikh Abi al-Bayan, and others amongst our contemporaries. None of these men permit for the traveler to abandon calling to the good and calling away from evil, even if he happens to fly the mighty sky or walk the vast ocean. Rather, they call the traveler to remain steadfast in matters which have been ordained, and categorically reject those matters which have been outcasted till the day he dies. This is no doubt the truth which The Qur’an, The Sunna, and the entirety of the Salaf have indicated, and such was a vast bulk of their discourse.”

    -Ibn Taymiyyah (Majmu’)
38. tru_Qur'an says:

    September 1, 2008 at 10:30 pm

    Ibn Ahmad..jazak’Allah khair for the translation.

    ‘EID MUBARAK BROTHERS AND SISTERS !!!
39. Abul Layth says:

    September 3, 2008 at 6:33 am

    Another useful article pertaining to this topic:

    http://www.masud.co.uk/ISLAM/misc/al50errs.htm
40. the_grand_verbalizer says:

    November 21, 2008 at 12:49 pm

    Abu Layth knocked the ball out of the park with his last post. Mash’Allah !

41. Pingback: Rational Quranic Religion Vs. Wahhabism - Seeking Ilm (Knowledge)

42. Confused Salafi says:

    October 4, 2009 at 5:51 pm

    I really had picking and choosing reminds me of church also now that I re-studied Aqidah Tahawiyyah as explained by a Shaykh with ijazah in the book I am starting to realize the concept of a god who lives above the 7th heaven seating on a throne reminds me of the church.
43. Amar says:

    October 5, 2009 at 6:58 am

    as salamu alaykum

    Dear Brother Confused Salafi,

    Brother Ibn Tamiyyah (the one on this forum, not the historical figure) summed this up nicely when he said:

    “The Aqeedah of the Ash’ariyyah
    The Aqeedah of the Maturidiyyah
    The Aqeedah of the Athariyyah/Hanabila.

    Now this last category is the “predecessor’ of the aqida of today’s salafis. Maybe in our times some of the formerly less-popular views in the Athari aqeeda have gained more popularity among the atharis/Hanbalis/ Salafis, but the point is..they have a source. Let’s all just respect each other.”

    This was wall said, jazakAllahu Khayr.

    If you learn Aqidah, then please learn it from the source. For example, when I first learned about Ash’ary Aqidah, I learned it from a Salafi source, which did not contain the most accurate description. I do not appreciate as some even said “They (the Ash’ariyyah took their knowledge from the Greek homosexuals.” Such vulgar statements are not acceptable in our Deen.

    Likewise, when I learned what some of the Ash’ary said about the Athariyyah, it was not very accurate. Athariyah does not say “Allah is a deity with limbs sitting on a chair above the sky.” How can one say that when everyone knows “Laya kamithlihi shay” (Nothing is similar to Him).

    One should study and appreciate the great works of these scholars WITHOUT discrediting or pitting one against the other and without misconstruing the points of others simply to make one seem correct.

    If a person says “I fear my Lord above me” – is this wrong?
    Allah said when describing the believers:

    “They fear their Lord above them.” (Qur’an 16:50)

    Or if someone says “Allah from above the seven heavens blessed me.” – is this wrong? Zainab (the wife of the Prophet [p]) said:

    “It is only your parents who gave you in marriage to the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam, while it is Allah Who gave me in marriage to him from above the seven heavens.” (Bukhari)

    Likewise, if someone says “I fear my Lord who encompasses me from every direction!” – is this wrong? Allah said:

    “To Allah belong the east and the West: Whithersoever ye turn, there is the presence of Allah . For Allah is all-Pervading, all-Knowing.” (Qur’an 2:115)

    The point here is that the Ash’ariyyah, the Maturidiyyah, and the
    Athariyyah all have arguments to express their points and they are all acceptable. Only Allah knows the reality of the unseen.

    Therefore, my sincere advice is to caution from falling into the trap of disunity over these issues.

    Shaikh Faraz Rabbani summed this up beautifully:

    “As for the criticism that some major Hanbalis held beliefs that smacked of anthropomorphism ['representation of God as having human form or traits'], this is true but unfair: it is also true that some Shafiis had such beliefs, and some were Mutazili rationalists; the same is also true of the Hanafi school. However, what matters is the general case (al-`ibra li’l ghalib), and the overwhelming majority of Hanbalis had sound beliefs, as is the case in the other schools.

    It is from the unfortunate attacks against the edifice of Sunni Islam that people pick on minor cases or rare historical incidents (like the occasional periods of inter-madhhab dispute) and try to generalize these into a history of discord whose existence is solely in their creative imaginations. Reality, for those who seek it, is that there was a remarkable unity that was based on a foundation of acceptance of difference of opinion within the limits; and a wisdom and pragmatism that avoided fitna with those whose ways diverged from the sound path of the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) and his inheritors, the scholars of Sunni Islam.”

    http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=7&ID=4856&CATE=24

    Finally, my sincere apologizes as I know this thread was not initially about this subject.
44. Abul Layth says:

    October 5, 2009 at 7:19 am

    Amar,

    The athari creed is the creed of affirmation with tafwid of the real meaning to Allah ta’ala. It is not saying Allah is LITERALLY – in the “real” sense of the word (as said by Ibn Uthaymin) – sitting (istiqrr) upon the throne, or that he “rose above the throne ‘in person’” http://seekingilm.com/archives/119 .

    What the pseudo-salafis are upon today is not the athari creed!

    was-salam,
    Abul Layth
45. Hasan Ashraf says:

    October 6, 2009 at 10:52 pm

    That is a well said statement. The Salafis today try to gain legitimacy by associating themselves with other legitimate movements, such as the Atharis; but in reality they are not legitimate. The Atahri’s believe in not discussing certain aspects of aqeedah, which they believe to be beyond the human intellect. But Salafis explain those statements more clearly than Asharis and Maturidis.

    The Salafis are full of contradictions. The Salafis say that they are against taqlid, but they follow their scholars (or rather non-scholars, such as Albani) more strictly than we follow the mujtahid mutlaqs of our maddhahib. Everything that they say they do, along with their catchy slogans, such as “the Quran and the sunnah only” are only that–slogans. They follow neither the Quran nor the Sunnah.
46. Abul Layth says:

    October 7, 2009 at 1:57 am

    You certainly hit the nail on the head!
47. Amar says:

    October 7, 2009 at 8:41 am

    As Salamu Alaykum wa Rahmatullah,

    Brother Abul Layth, I’ll admit it is news to me that the Athari Aqidah difers from now and then. My understanding, although you’ve got me thinking, was that the “the meaning” was known, but the how was not. Based on the well known incident with Imam Malik that is always mentioned.

    Currently I am studying Ash’ari aqidah. Do you have any books or works on scholars that compare the differences between Athari, now and then? JazakAllahu Khayr

    ma salam
48. stranger says:

    June 11, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    jazakallah khair
49. stranger says:

    June 11, 2010 at 7:07 pm

    assalaam aliykum brothers,

    what are all your opinions about the scholar maulana imran hosein of trinidad and tobago. because he says it is futile and wasting of time to discuss petty issues. instead we should identify the real enemy of muslims(US/Israel/European Alliance) and fight aginst them. also we should prepare ourselves to face the dajjal.

    Eagerly awaiting respone
    salaam
50. stranger says:

    June 23, 2010 at 6:51 pm

    assalaam walykum

    waiting for response
51. admin says:

    June 24, 2010 at 8:16 am

    Wa’alaykum salam,

    I do not know the Shaykh so I cannot speak regarding him. However, it is an obligation to continue amr bil ma’ruf wa nahi ‘an al munkar un – commanding of good and forbidding of evil – until the last hour. The heretics and their allies must be exposed in order for the mass of Muslims to be warned of their distortions regarding our deen. If such was not done throughout history, the Sunnah would not be accessible to us to this day.

    There is certainly no doubt that the end of times is near, however, and the Muslims have believed this for 1500 years , yet such did not stop them from warning the Muslims from the deviants that existed within their era – whether it be the batiniyyah, mu’tazilah, muqatiliyyah – which have re-emerged in our times vomitting their tashbih and tajsim and branding it the ‘way of the salaf’ with their forked tongues.

    If one stops and reflects on the past 150 years – the demise of the khalifah and how it occurred – the re-emergence of the Ibn taymiyyite doctrines innovated by him , I think they will see that the Sunnis were slow to act against the deviations of our time, and as a result such deviations were allowed to flourish for too long…